Thread: God vs Science - What is Faith? - Must Read

God vs Science - What is Faith?

An atheist Professor of philosophy speaks to his class on the problem science has with God, The Almighty.
He asks one of his new Students to stand and.....

Prof: So you believe in God?
Student: Absolutely, sir.
Prof : Is God good?
Student: Sure.
Prof: Is God all-powerful?
Student : Yes.
Prof: My brother died of cancer even though he prayed to God to heal him.
Most of us would attempt to help others who are ill. But God didn't. How is this God good then? Hmm?
(Student is silent.)
Prof: You can't answer, can you? Let's start again, young fella. Is God good?
Student: Yes.
Prof: Is Satan good?
Student : No.
Prof: Where does Satan come from?
Student: From...God....
Prof: That's right. Tell me son, is there evil in this world?
Student: Yes.
Prof: Evil is everywhere, isn't it? And God did make everything. Correct?
Student: Yes.
Prof: So who created evil?
(Student does not answer.)
Prof: Is there sickness? Immorality? Hatred? Ugliness? All these terrible things exist in the world, don't they?
Student: Yes, sir.
Prof: So, who created them?
(Student has no answer.)
Prof: Science says you have 5 senses you use to identify and observe the world around you.
Tell me, son...Have you ever seen God?
Student: No, sir.
Prof: Tell us if you have ever heard your God?
Student: No, sir.
Prof: Have you ever felt your God, tasted your God, smelt your God? Have you ever had any sensory perception of God for that matter?
Student: No, sir. I'm afraid I haven't.
Prof: Yet you still believe in Him?
Student: Yes.
Prof: According to empirical, testable, demonstrable protocol, science says your GOD doesn't exist.
What do you say to that, son?
Student: Nothing. I only have my faith.
Prof: Yes. Faith. And that is the problem science has.

Student: Professor, is there such a thing as heat?
Prof: Yes.
Student: And is there such a thing as cold?
Prof: Yes.
Student: No sir. There isn't.
(The lecture theatre becomes very quiet with this turn of events.)
Student : Sir, you can have lots of heat, even more heat, superheat, mega heat, white heat, a little heat or no heat.
But we don't have anything called cold. We can hit 458 degrees below zero which is no heat, but we can't go any further after that.
There is no such thing as cold . Cold is only a word we use to describe the absence of heat . We cannot measure cold. Heat is energy . Cold is not the opposite of heat, sir, just the absence of it . (There is pin-drop silence in the lecture theatre.)
Student: What about darkness, Professor? Is there such a thing as darkness?
Prof: Yes. What is night if there isn't darkness?
Student : You're wrong again, sir. Darkness is the absence of something. You can have low light, normal light, bright
light, flashing light....But if
you have no light constantly, you have nothing and it's called darkness, isn't it? In reality, darkness isn't. If it were you would be able to make
darkness darker, wouldn't you?
Prof: So what is the point you are making, young man?
Student: Sir, my point is your philosophical premise is flawed.
Prof: Flawed? Can you explain how?
Student: Sir, you are working on the premise of duality. You argue there is life and then there is death, a good God and a bad God. You are viewing the concept of God as something finite, something we can measure. Sir, science can't even explain a thought. It uses electricity and magnetism, but has never seen, much less fully understood either one.To view death as the opposite of life is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive thing. Death is not the opposite of life: just the absence of it.
Now tell me, Professor. Do you teach your Students that they evolved from a monkey?
Prof: If you are referring to the natural evolutionary process, yes, of course, I do.
Student: Have you ever observed evolution with your own eyes, sir?
(The Professor shakes his head with a smile, beginning to realize where the argument is going.)
Student: Since no one has ever observed the process of evolution at work and cannot even prove that this process is an on-going endeavor, are you not teaching your opinion, sir? Are you not a scientist but a preacher? (The class is in uproar.)
Student: Is there anyone in the class who has ever seen the Professor's brain?
(The class breaks out into laughter.)
Student : Is there anyone here who has ever heard the Professor's brain, felt it, touched or smelt it? No one appears to have done so. So, according to the established rules of empirical, stable, demonstrable protocol, science says that you have no brain, sir.
With all due respect, sir, how do we then trust your lectures, sir?
(The room is silent. The Professor stares at the Student, his face unfathomable.)
Prof: I guess you'll have to take them on faith, son.
Student: That is it sir.... The link between man & god is FAITH . That is all that keeps things moving & alive.

P.S:

this is a true story, and the

Student was none other than.........
..
.
. ..
A P J ABDUL KALAM…the former President of India. - This attribution is according to the mail i received.

well, according to some sources on the internet:

It’s a fictional story that has been attributed to many people including Albert Einstein, A P J ABDUL KALAM.

these might not be true. But the Conversation is no doubt thought provoking.

Got this in mail today and wanted to share with all of you. I couldnt find an appropriate section for it, so posted it here.

I would like to have your valuable comments on this.

Abdul Kalam was not the person. This is a fake email going around
originally with Einstein's name in it.

-F

p.s and btw the students arguments are not very sound and can
be refuted easily.

Originally Posted by farce

Abdul Kalam was not the person. This is a fake email going around
originally with Einstein's name in it.

-F

are you sure? then i will edit it.

Originally Posted by saurav_kataruka

are you sure? then i will edit it.

I am sure. You might as well put this:


Student was none other than.........
..
.
. ..
FARCE …the resident IBB Mythbuster.


-F

Einstein proves God in an encounter with a professor-Fiction!

snopes.com: Einstein Humiliates Atheist

-F

ok.. i also searched a few sites for this. even it was not einstein. i have edited the post accordingly. is it OK now?

Originally Posted by saurav_kataruka

ok.. i also searched a few sites for this. even it was not einstein. i have edited the post accordingly. is it OK now?

Sure.... I would have felt better if you had written

many people including Albert Einstein, A P J ABDUL KALAM, FARCE...




-F

Originally Posted by farce

sure.... I would have felt better if you had written

many people including albert einstein, a p j abdul kalam, farce...


:d

-f

:d:d:d:d

Originally Posted by farce

p.s and btw the students arguments are not very sound and can be refuted easily.

Being curious here, what is your line of argument ?

Originally Posted by vikramjb

Being curious here, what is your line of argument ?

I'll take one easy example

Student : Is there anyone here who has ever heard the Professor's brain, felt it, touched or smelt it? No one appears to have done so. So, according to the established rules of empirical, stable, demonstrable protocol, science says that you have no brain, sir.

All I need is an MRI or a CT scan to send that argument to the recycle bin

-F

p.s I am not an atheist.

farcey ....u r jus too much.....!!!

amazing sense of humour u ve got.....must admit....

Interesting observations about the brain. The Human Brain can be taken in two contexts:

- The Human brain. The organ that controls the other organs, nervous system and response of the body
- The Human brain. The organ of the body that has intelligence. It can store information from the five sensory organs, interprete them and program responses for them. The thinking part that uses pervious associations and derives the course of action to be taken in case of an unknown situation. The intelligent organ that brings forth new ideas, inventions, discoveries, etc. This part (as a whole) is absent in other creatures of the earth. Some creatures may have some basic intelligence but they do not have capacity to invent tools and techniques to an entirely new level.

If you take the second context then the student's argument holds fort.

I have read this earlier somewhere....

Hmmmm what you say is true, but at the same time, MRI or a CT scan shouldn't be the only tools that we use confirm the fact a person has a brain right ?

I am not much of an athesit. I do beleieve in God but sort in a sane way .

its the belief tht matters...

Originally Posted by vikramjb

Hmmmm what you say is true, but at the same time, MRI or a CT scan shouldn't be the only tools that we use confirm the fact a person has a brain right ?

Sure, as they say, there are many ways to skin a cat ;-) (or an octopus )

-F

leave the octupus alone dude we don't wanna do a MRI or CT scan to prove it has a brain.

Frankly every single person in the world knows that God is based on belief, those who fanatically beleieve in God sometimes tend to go overboard. There are lots of other orthodox habits which are tied to God.

I beleieve in a single universal power which drives the whole world, let it be Shiva, Vishnu or Braham or Jesus or Allah. For that matter let it be even science, I care a damn. This god gives us beleief which in turn makes us do things that otherwise we might find difficult.

Now what did the cat do to you man that you are skinning it , for the cat you might the God, if you have on that is ;-)

Originally Posted by vikramjb

leave the octupus alone dude we don't wanna do a MRI or CT scan to prove it has a brain.



Now what did the cat do to you man that you are skinning it , for the cat you might the God, if you have on that is ;-)

I didn't make it up. It is a well known idiom.
There are many ways to skin a cat - Idiom Definition - UsingEnglish.com

-F

p.s the octopus reference was from the other thread where we argued
http://www.indiabroadband.net/food/1...tml#post121159 (Thai food vs Chinese food)

God Humor Going Around Here!!!

Who are you calling an Idiot

I know about cat skinning phrase, i read it in some book and was like wtf, but then i understood the true meaning

what makes you think we are not arguing here ?

Do you beleive in a Centralised Power Sharing for god or is it decentralised ?

One of my Physics Professors had taught us about Luminiferous Ether, which was the hypothetical medium or substance through which electromagnetic radiations propagate. He told that it is called 'The Immaterial Medium'. This had explained that even electromagnetic radiations like light need a medium travelled.


As per the things I have learnt, a material medium is anything that we can feel with any or all of our 5 senses. And, Luminiferous Ether had thus at the time of Maxwell (If I am remembering it right), explained the existence of an omnipresent medium (Which was considered to be 'God' by most of the world).


The story then changed a lot. In 1887, a crucial experiment was performed by Michelson and Edward Morley in an attempt to detect the existence of the ether. The experiment, named the Michelson-Morley experiment in honor of its authors, shocked the scientific community by yielding results which implied the non-existence of ether. This result was later on used by Einstein to refute the existence of the ether and allowed him to develop special relativity without this artificial (and non-existent) constraint.

Originally Posted by vikramjb

Who are you calling an Idiot

I know about cat skinning phrase, i read it in some book and was like wtf, but then i understood the true meaning

what makes you think we are not arguing here ?

Do you beleive in a Centralised Power Sharing for god or is it decentralised ?

I am not calling anyone an idiot. Sorry if you felt that way...

I am not sure I understand your question about power sharing.
Do you mean there are multiple gods for each thing?

-F

Originally Posted by dhaneshv

One of my Physics Professors had taught us about Luminiferous Ether, which was the hypothetical medium or substance through which electromagnetic radiations propagate. He told that it is called 'The Immaterial Medium'. This had explained that even electromagnetic radiations like light need a medium travelled.


As per the things I have learnt, a material medium is anything that we can feel with any or all of our 5 senses. And, Luminiferous Ether had thus at the time of Maxwell (If I am remembering it right), explained the existence of an omnipresent medium (Which was considered to be 'God' by most of the world).


The story then changed a lot. In 1887, a crucial experiment was performed by Michelson and Edward Morley in an attempt to detect the existence of the ether. The experiment, named the Michelson-Morley experiment in honor of its authors, shocked the scientific community by yielding results which implied the non-existence of ether. This result was later on used by Einstein to refute the existence of the ether and allowed him to develop special relativity without this artificial (and non-existent) constraint.



Agh.....That was some righting. It took me a lot time to recall everything...

Did you guys like it?
I wonder....

That's pretty good. I am impressed.

-F

Originally Posted by farce

That's pretty good. I am impressed.

-F

Aghh.....
It was really stupid of me. I have now removed the last lines.
Sorry.

I was kind of........
Not thinking about anything then....

Originally Posted by aashaka_gandhi

farcey ....u r jus too much.....!!!

amazing sense of humour u ve got.....must admit....

Thanks for the compliments Aashaka.

Like the Oyster that develops a pearl to surround its irritating grain of sand,
so did I develop this sense of humor to mask the bitter experiences
life threw at me years back.....


OK that was enough seriousness, let's get back to some fun ;-)

-F

Originally Posted by farce

I am not calling anyone an idiot. Sorry if you felt that way...

I am not sure I understand your question about power sharing.
Do you mean there are multiple gods for each thing?

-F

Seriously farce I was kidding man, my sense of humour sometimes slips. No need to ask for sorry man

Yes I meant having single god rather than having multiple gods for each thing.

Dhanesh, that's some writeup. I read in Tinkle once that all humans are surrounded by electrical field which acts sort like a invisible shield. Is that true ?